Topic #2. the tv show...
(Showing 149-163 of 181)

149. To the rescue,
Mon, Sep 27, 1999 - 1:27 PM/EST
atma

You are not the last. I've been following the posts here since last week. Sue seems to think

that shedding the extra labels would resolve some of the problems. I am old enough to remember when

we were all just Americans, but there were still references to negros or coloreds and jews and a variety of references to people with Spanish surnames. Racism was every bit as bad as it is now. I think the difference is that we can look back and see how it was covered up awkwardly with

ideas like "urban renewal" building "projects" that would serve as urban reservations to prevent

integration in housing. But they showing that they "cared" about providing housing for the disenfranchised minorities (read blacks and poor whites and hispanics). There was tokenism that sought to treat the problem of racism in employment. They would hire a minority and place them in a visible area so that the world could see that they were not racists. That person might have been the only minority in the company though.

Racism is like a disease. It can not be treated topically. It is a systemic problem that needs to be addressed from the inside. But what does that mean? It means that it will be very difficult to cure the disease without causing some harm to the patient. The patient may not want to be treated.

But you know it is for the good of the enire society that the disease be treated. Sometimes a patient can be told to be treated or die. It may work or it may backfire. It seems easier to work with a willing patient. Once they have been transformed, they can help convince others who have the disease of the benefits of treatment.

Well, this is a start. What do you guys think?

150. viennes
Mon, Sep 27, 1999 - 6:19 PM/EST
artist39

Thanks for your concern. My health is excellent, I exercise regularly and take pretty good care of myself. Try to think of me as fiesty and passionate, and regarding this subject, I am both. As far as race in this country goes, I am being realistic, not negative. As I have said before, my kids are very bright and optimistic about themselves, in spite of this madness. We learn to live in contradictions all the time. Anyway, enough about me.

I agree with Atma, it is a disease that needs to be treated, resistance or not. As a community we have to take responsibility for helping kids suceed, despite the odds that are stacked against

them. Try to penetrate the educational system and support parents in supporting their kids. It is really hard out there, just getting by and making ends meet can be overwhelming. We live in

isolated communities these days, staying in our own little boxes and play it safe. There are many examples of folks moving outside those perimeters to make some headway on the racial polarization as well as to create more supportive communities.

I do not think we can wait for people, particularlly those who are educating our kids, to chose transformation. Too much damage is being done in the classroom. The school system must require diversity training on an ongoing basis as part of being a teacher. One step anyway.

Also, if anyone gets the SF Chronicle or wants to go online to read it, there is an article on the TV series on the op-ed section. Check it out and tell me what you think.

151. parental responsibility
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 1:11 AM/EST
atma

So much of what affects our children begins in the home environment. When you have adults/teenagers having children without understanding what it all entails, the problem will persist. Many use the biological fact that they can have children as a way to reinforce feelings of personal inadequacy or lack of self esteem/confidence. After all, if a child can refer to you as mom or dad, it must mean that you are grownup and adult right? It's like a right of passage that you can pick on your own. It's is the logic of underdeveloped psyches. Adding to this mix the reinforcement from media ads, movies and TV. There are kids getting hooked on tobacco and alcohol before they are even old enough to buy these products legally. This requires cooperation and total community and societal or institutional involvement.

As a father of two girls I make sure that my children are away from these substances. Parents with bad habits often share them with their children unfortunately. It's not a big surprise that so many kids mimic these behaviors.

There are frankly too many people (more than a few) who should never be allowed to have children.

But we live in a democracy that guarantees that this wont change. So we are presented with a unique set of issues requiring a lot of creative problem solving talents. Where are the thousands of Phds and policy people? And why aren't the being listened to? What good are they if we continue to face these seemingly intractable problems in the "greatest" country in the world.

152. Sue
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 1:32 AM/EST
atma

Separatist sentiment has been with us since the 1800"s. Remember the Civil War. It has a long tradition in this country. We didn't want to live with those "red savages" so after taking their land we placed them far away from "us". After the

blacks were "emancipated", We didn't want to live with them either, unless they were our servants or slaves. Then they could stay in special living quarters set up in a barn or some other kind of structure.

This idea is quite "American". Religious communities came here for religious tolerance and found themselves assimilated or separated. America is an experiment that still need a lot of tinkering before it can really live up to it's professed ideals.

153. OK
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 2:54 AM/EST
viennes

artist39, I like fiesty and passionate, I will stop worrying about you're health, go get em.

atma,although I do agree that there are a lot of people that should not have children,but that is getting into dangerouse territory,where would you draw the line who or who could not have children,who would make that decision,Government? they are to involved as it is (Big Brother is watching you)Soon they would tell you no interracial children should be born, because it is to hard on the children (it would be an excuse)

As a father with a bad smoking habit, I do see the concern, Luckily (as far as I know) none of my children smoke,It is hard for a parent that smokes to tell his children not to, but that did not stop me,I stated to them that, use me as am example how bad it is, smoke breath,stinks up the place, addictive and so on, it seems to have worked.It is not easy to stop, I have tried, I guesse I don't have the will power,but I look at it this way,knowing that I got hooked on smoking and knowing that my will power is poor,I stayed away from drinking,and heavy drugs fearing getting hooked on them like smoking.

Lets do some tinkering, if that is what it takes.How is a different ?.

atma, thanks for the rescue.

atma, how old are you're girls,if you dont mind me asking.

154. atma
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 3:05 AM/EST
artist39

Sometimes I have to laugh becusae I can't believe I am a grownup and have the responsibility of raising two kids who getting big themselves. Although I am a responsible parent, I am bewildered by how confused I can feel on certain days. When feeling that way I chuckle....I worry that parents are going to come home and get angry about my taking the car without permission. It is crazy really, that any of us have the nerve to raise kids. True that some people are less prepared than others, if you can really be prepared, and for those kids and parents, the job

is all the more difficult. Whatever the reasons people have children, once they are in the world, we as a society have a share of the responsibility of providing some basic services so we do not loose another generation to despair and hopelessness and create more children for the wrong reasons.

155. atma
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 8:39 AM/EST
atma

I don't want the Government to decide who can have kids. I was really expressing my own sentiment about what I have experienced in other communities. There are poor people and rich people

mentally ill people(some undiagnosed) and others who would not make good parents. But once these children are in the world, we should do what ever it takes to save these children from lives of abuse and misery. Anyone working in Children's Welfare can attest that many more children should be removed from homes than they can afford to act on due to budgetary restraints. It comes back down to what are we will to spend to save children.

156. age
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 10:51 AM/EST
artist39

I am 42-going-on-43. My kids, 18 and 14, though now that I am prparing my house for interior painting and am going through photo albums, I wonder where the time has gone!!!!

I have worked in Child Welfare, as a CPS worker with families whose kids are wards of the state but live in the home with court ordered mandates for the parents. What I saw was a great desparity in how poor families were treated, particullary minority families. The wealthy sexual abuseres who had good lawyers kept their kids and their arrogance, while the other population was delt a different card. It is very difficult to do that kind of work, and in order to do it proerly you have to be a bit more elastic than I was willing to be. If kids are going to remain in the family, then a great deal of support is necessary, for as we all know, true change and transformation is a long and painful process. It really is a lifelong process.

I am for quality education, and I mean quality, in the schools that provides community typw centers in the schools for the entire family, view the school as the main community based organization. From my perspective, the school is best place to engage kids and families, and the earlier the better.

157. viennes and everyone else
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 5:50 PM/EST
atma

I am 48 years old. I waited untill I was in my 40's before getting married. My youngest daughter is 7 and the oldest is 14.

158. Now lets talk about "Social Class".
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 6:01 PM/EST
atma

Artist39, or is that artist42? Anyway, the deeper we dig into the problem of racism, issues of social class and wealth are unavoidable and need serious inspection/investigation. Any takers on getting started down this scary path. Are you ready to be called a "communist" just for talking about this issue?

159. atma
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 6:29 PM/EST
artist39

I am all for a conversation about class...go for it!

160. Extreme Tolerance
Tue, Sep 28, 1999 - 11:27 PM/EST

Did anyone see the show on PBS? If so, how do you feel about it and how do you think it applies to your everyday life?

161. sue
Wed, Sep 29, 1999 - /EST
artist39

I did not see it, can you briefly describe it for those of us who did not see it. other than the Lovestories, I hardly watch TV. Okay, well maybe ER on Thursday evenings!

162. TV show
Wed, Sep 29, 1999 - 4:11 AM/EST
atma

My opinion of "American Love Story" is incomplete.

I am still working through how the project was developed and what the intent truly was. Was there more than one agenda? Other than that I thought of it as a unique documentary that provided the viewers with more than a glimpse into the lives of four people. It succeeded in showing us how one particular family dealt with issues of race intheir lives. It chose a family that some would not be sympathetic to to prove that the documentary was not trying to sell a message and at the same time demonstrate that showing a family that has difficulties portrays an

honest perspective how many in our society see "interracial relationships". We find that some stereotypes seemed to be in reinforced all around and some stereotypes that just were'nt there. I did not see every single episode in full but I think I saw enough to draw some conclusions.

163. TV show
Wed, Sep 29, 1999 - 4:15 AM/EST
atma

I think it is important not to over analyze something like this TV show. It will only take one so far. Not everyone is going to be in agreement about what they saw. This is not that unusual. What is important is that the TV show act as a catalyst for disscusion.