25 and Under Group 3: Can Black/White Realtionships Work, Longterm?

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Topic #2. Can Black/White Realtionships Work, Longterm?
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1. Can Black/White Realtionships Work, Longterm?
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 1:28 PM/EST

This is something that I've been considering for some time now...

I say "Black and White because I feel that it is between these two groups there is the greatest level of animosity/conflict.

One reason: the whole subordinate dynamic always exists; by that I mean to say that the whole condition of blacks having been slaves is suggestive of an inferiority which causes a stigma no other race of people are burdened with (or at least not to such a high degree).

There is little or no support structure or reaffirmation of these types of relationships, which makes them less than practical for progressive (white collar) Americans, especially for white Americans.

Of course there are always exceptions, but does anyone feel that this type of union can succeed commonly?

2. I believe...
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 2:23 PM/EST
watersave

I would say that it is only uncommon because we as a society have made it so.

We have made ourselves separatists for the most part, thereby closing ourselves off to other people groups.

I know it can succeed, just as I know that any marriage "can" succeed, when based on a good foundation. I think it is a logical fallacy to say something like this:

"There is little or no support structure or reaffirmation of these types of relationships..."

...because we have the institution of marriage (which when its right, its wonderful, but with the wrong person can be a real struggle...eh, either way, it can be a struggle :-)) as a reaffirmation of relationships overall.

When we come into marriage or any other relationship, we bring ourselves into it completely-everything we are, our quirks, our joys, our insecurities-and those are all a part of our makeup as a person. My wife is who she is because of the way she was raised and she (liek all of us) is a product of her environment-which happened to be the suburbs. Her mom worked a job that paid very well and they never really struggled to make ends meet or anything like that. So, basically, that was my same situation. I was more or less raised by my mother (as was my wife) and we both understand and share a lot of family situations and experiences.

cont next post

3. me again...
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 2:24 PM/EST
watersave

I will say, though, that my wife is who she is also because of the fact that she is black. As I am who I am because I am white. I have lost jobs because I am white. I lost promotions because I am white (the boss even told me that). I have experienced discrimination, but not like my wife has in her past, I am sure. I (unlike most blacks in America) can go into the store of my choice and not get eyed the whole time I am there, so that is a difference that I understand (actually got that down before I ever met her by hanging out with all my black friends).

Anyway, i am saying that I find it unfair to say there is no support for an interracial marriage. We have a whole web of support for ours-our family, our church, our friends. And I can look at other people with great marriages and learn from that.

If I missed the point, sorry, just my 2 cents.

Grace and Peace,

Waters Ave

4. A wholistic perspective
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 3:53 PM/EST

Admittedly, one could argue that I am not the best judge of the interracial dynamic. Though I've been in relationships, I've never been "tied" or "committed" in any real sense...

If the tension got to be too thick, I could always just walk away. But this is in part due to what I mentioned in my earlier post.

Waters Ave, I must re-assert that the majority of people DO NOT support or reaffirm interracial unions (at least not between Blks & Whts), and never will. Maybe your own personal experience has shown you something else, but I'm speaking in terms of the entire HUMAN collective...

Because to do this would mean for whites to sacrifice there very whiteness, and that is not a comforting prospect to most of them (and rightly so IMHO). I suspect it is quite easy for negroes to undermine these values due to the fact that the end result of these unions leads to a child which is essential considered black. Albeit significantly less so that its black parent, thus giving it a better chance to be accepted in this world.

Blacks have nothing to lose in these unions because they are at the bottom of the social ladder and can only go up.

But white people cannot embrace these unions on a large scale, it threatens there very whiteness. I find that a many whites who DO venture outside there "race" tend not to feel any particular connection with "whiteness" OR have been ostracized by other whites for some flaw or failing.

I'm not saying a black/white union can't be a healthy relationship, but the white participant must realize that they are sacrificing there white lineage...

For most whites (moreso men than women, I think this may be due to mans instinctual urge to further his own genes and a womans instinctual nurturing function) this is too great a sacrifice because in this world, I think, there is nothing better in terms of advantage and social potential than to be white.

I am a non-white BTW. :-)

5. Realisation
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 4:20 PM/EST

Before I ventured outside my race I did not feel ostracized by other whites, but I really didn't feel a connection either. Honestly, I never really thought about it before. Then I happened to fall for a guy who was black and once I was in the relationship I started thinking about it. Before I always considered myself non-racist but then I realised I had alot of pre-conceived notions, not that they were all bad, but they were there just the same.

6. Philosophising....
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 5:06 PM/EST
bbbarbs

We could have very long drawn out academic discussions about how our society will never support interracial relationships. However I prefer to look at things with more realism. I live in Chicago in one of the few integrated middle class neighborhoods in this country. There is some animosity here between the races but there is a lot of tolerance and friendships as well. My neighborhood is actually famous for accepting interracial couples. As I said in my intro I am involved in an interracial relationship and I think it's silly to argue about whether society "supports" my relationship our not. I don't really give a damn if they do or don't. I love my boyfriend deeply, he's my best friend. Neither of us care what other people think about us or anything else. I can only do what makes me happy, not everyone else. We have not struggled with black/white issues. Our problems have only stemmed from male/femal issues. I think that proteus is too concerned with how society looks upon black/white relationships. People adapt very quickly and generation after generation is changing it's views about race. I agree that it will probably be several 100 years before society accepts interracial relationships, but I'm not going to wait that long to be in one. That would be idiotic. I love my boyfriend for the wonderful man he is, which includes his lovely brown outer covering. So, yes I think that black/white relationships can endure with love, I see them everyday.

7. Realistically
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 6:35 PM/EST
qiana

I have to agree that there in this society there is no reaffirmation for interracial relationships. In the past several years of being involved in such a relationship I have had many struggles within myself as a black woman and with family,friends, and strangers. I do not agree with proteus who seems to imply that for me marrying a white man is nothing but a benefit for me. I may have to live in a society where it is believed that everything that is white is better but I do not have to accept those beliefs as my own.

8. Although...
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 7:00 PM/EST

I can see the points of proteus...I listened to it many times...although I must admit that you actually make sense and do not attack white people as many non-whites do. However, I think that one thing we fail to realize is that people do not often step out of themselves to see themselves the way the world sees them. They simply believe in certain things without realizing that everyone else may not see it the same way.

I really don't see the point in being so concerned with how society views interracial couples...if you love someone that should be all that matters. I know that it's different for some of you who are only one race....for biracial people like me it's different because we create a interracial relationship of our own sort.

9. Although...
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 7:00 PM/EST

10. Although...
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 7:00 PM/EST

11. Although...
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 7:01 PM/EST

12. Sorry
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 7:03 PM/EST

Sorry for the multi post!!!!

13. yes..
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 9:31 PM/EST
christina21

I do believe that black/white relationships can work. Yes, the couple is faced with a lot obstacles but if they both are strong and want it to work, it can. We saw a good example, Bill and his wife (I cant remember her name now..sorry) had a lot to deal with but they continued on with their relationship despite what others thought. A lot of people like to say that things are different nowadays but, realisticly, people are still being discrimanted against. I feel that today it is not as 'vocalized' as it was before.

With strength, support, and determination a relationship can exist. I'm not saying that it is right that people are forced to "fight" to be in a relationship in which they are truly happy. However, this seems to be something that has to be done in our society.

14. YES....Society is only a part
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 11:18 PM/EST
littlekat

I remember when I was in junior high and started taking a serious interest in guys, my mom told me that I could get married to whoever loved me and treated me right - no matter what color their skin was. But, that going out with someone of another race would just made the relationship more complicated (implying that it would be better if I stuck with white guys.) Well that was 10 years ago and since then almost all the guys I have gone out with have been black, a fact reflective of my social circle. Because of American society's general discomfort with black/white relationships, I do, in some ways, agree with my mothers assertion that interracial relationships are more complicated. However, when it comes down to it, a relationship is all about interaction between two people. Society's perceptions of your relationship will play as little or as large a role as you let them. Yes, I definately believe long term interracial relationhips are possible. My relationship with my current boyfriend, who is black, is still going strong after more than two years. This is a man I can see spending the rest of my life with.

He and I have may have different colored skin and be viewed differently by the dominant culture, but we share many similar experience and many elements of a common culture - He being influenced by the white manistream, and me by the African American culture which has filled my environment. (Sorry this is so long, but this is a subject I could talk about for days.)

15. And to that I say...
Fri, Sep 17, 1999 - 11:48 PM/EST
watersave

Proteus, you said:

"I'm not saying a black/white union can't be a healthy relationship, but the white participant must realize that they are sacrificing there white lineage..."

I think I sacrificed that lineage the day that one of my Irish ancestors hopped into bed with one of my Cherokee ancestors. And, yes, my Cherokee heritage is pretty close...just look at my mom. I just got a ton of those Irish genes.

My wife is a mix of racial harmony as well-native American, African, and European, but both immediate parents are black. Even though one may not consider ones self to be multi racial, almost all of us are mixed to some degree, and I don't truly see how that affects me socially.

And as for climbing a social ladder, my wife's family made more money than mine, so maybe I was the one that climbed up a few rungs. It just seems like a moot point. Both of her parents went to college...both of mine never attended college-they are not nor were they ever "white trash," they just didn't attend college. So, it seems as though your argument would make sense if the colors were switched. But as it stands, I just don't see it. Most of our friends that are in Interracial relationships (marriages and otherwise) are from similar situations.

For example, a married couple we know (white and hispanic) both grew up in the "hood." Both struggled with gang violence, drugs, and other inevitabilities of ghetto life. They were from the same culture despite their color. I just think it is all about where you come from and what you have come from.

I just think I should be pissed at my wife for having to give up my "whiteness." :-)

its only a joke, btw...

Grace and Peace,

Waters Ave

16. A question for everyone
Sat, Sep 18, 1999 - /EST
littlekat

I have a question for everyone out there, but let me preface it first. In the many black/white relationships I've been in, I've never felt any notable resistance from anyone's family; never been blatently been harrassed, glared at, or gossiped about, ect.. by people in public; and only on a few occassions been made to made to feel unconfortable about being together.

However, I do have a great fear of traveling much outside of California (and some places in California) because we are an interracial couple. I have heard a lot of bad stories about racism, coming from folks of all colors, in other parts of the county. (Not that Cali is exempt, I get the impression that its just not as bad.)

So, finally, my question is, what is it really like out there? What do you all see as the attitudes toward interracial relationships in the cities and regions you are familiar with.

Am I really naive to say that such relationships are becoming more acceptable. That is what seems to be going on where I live, and I would hope the trend in also going on elsewhere.

17. Things are tough all over
Sat, Sep 18, 1999 - 10:47 AM/EST

Yes, relationships are tough no matter who you are with. Interracial relationships can generally be a little tougher because of the different dynamics that society *tries* to force on us. It really comes down to the two people involved, everything else can be worked out.

I've always felt there was only one race -- the human race. The rest is just trivial.

It seems that each group of people tend to seperate themselves, always quick to point out their differences, rather than harmonize with their similarities. While it's great to celebrate cultural differences, the latter seems FAR more logical to me.

I am involved with a Cape Verdian (black) woman. I am multi-cultural (Sicilian, Lebanese, and more) but essentially a white American male. We've been together for 3 years and have been best friends for about 5 years. We are seriously committed to one another and plan to get married someday. We've had many discussions like this and I'm sure we always will.

The bottom line:

I believe interracial relationships can work.

18. Who is society?
Sat, Sep 18, 1999 - 1:44 PM/EST
hartwick

There have been several comments saying that society does not support interracial relationships. If we depended on societies support, blacks would still slaves in the South. Relationships don't need the support of society, relationships need the support of the people involved in that relationship. I think people spend too much time concerned with what society thinks rather than what they want. Who cares what the neighbor's think? Are the neighbor's going to pay your bills? Are the neighbor's going to care for you when you are sick? Are they gonna mourn when you're dead? Probably not. What people fail to realize is that WE are society..People make society sound like a committee making decisions...well it's not...WE ARE SOCIETY..if you do what you think is right instead of what people tell you is right, this country would be a better place...at least I'd like to hope so...

19. response to protheus
Sat, Sep 18, 1999 - 1:54 PM/EST
hartwick

You make it sound like blacks don't sacrifice as much as whites when they are in a relationship..You're saying that when there is an interracial relationship only whites sacrifice there heritage...Heritage isn't the color of your skin it is the culture and values you were brought up with...you make heritage sound like a skin color...Also, you make it seem like blacks climb the ladder when they are in interracial relationships....I don't know what stereotypes you're heard, but blacks are lawyers, doctors, judges,politicians and other professionals too..If a black doctor marries a white factory worker, do you really think that black doctor is climbing the ladder? I think you need to lose the stereotypes....Not all blacks are at the bottom of the ladder....many are at the top..

20. Interracial Dating
Sat, Sep 18, 1999 - 2:47 PM/EST
nubianpeach

Check this, I have a friend who dates a White guy,

although she claims that she doesn;t love him, I

still consider them a couple. The other day, she

started telling him Black history facts and accompliahments of Blacks. His response to her was, "Why are you telling me this, I don;t care." She got mad or whatever and felt as if he was not being culturally sensitive. Personally, I believe that this is the case with many more couples in interracial relationships whether they want to admit or not. She told me this out of her mouth, being with a person from another culture is exciting. She further commented that since it's such a taboo in society, it's like going against the grain of things. She claims that he has done things for her, that no man in her own race has ever done. I can relate this with, "The grass is always greener on the other side." Sounds like to me that she is not giving the men in her own race a chance, so she;s rebelling to explore new options. This sounds very similar to other cases of women exhaling. They want something different.

The question I want to ask, "What is like dating someone out of your race?" I've never had this experience and want to know if there's difference or not. Can someone answer that for me?

21. answers to some Questions
Sat, Sep 18, 1999 - 5:16 PM/EST
qiana

I think that I am qualified to answer two of the questions that have been placed on this board. littlekat asked about the acceptance of interracial couples outside of CA. My husband and I have lived in several areas around Boston and we lived in Nashville for a few years. I can honestly say that we have never had any problems anywhere. People always comment under their breath(especially Blacks) but I can live with that. It is pretty scary sometimes when we want to travel and just not knowing, its not like you can ask anyone. But we have gone around the country and never have been in any bad situations.

Also nubianpeach wanted to know what it was like to date outside of your race. I met my husband when I was 19 and I had dated alot but never a white man. I had never even contemplated it even though I have always had close friendships and gone to school with white people. I thought for sure our dating would only turn into a friendship. My family was surprised and thought it was a phase. But the more i got to know him the more i saw past "this white boy" and i saw him as a person a smart, wonderful man that loved me and would do anything for me. I have to say it was not easy getting past the feeling that I was betraying somebody, but who? I wasn't married, I diint owe anyone I wanted to live my life with the man of my chice without having to answer to anyone about why I love him. why not, he is easy to love.

22. Hard to accept
Sat, Sep 18, 1999 - 7:29 PM/EST
nubianpeach

In response to qiana, I don't know, its' hard for me to understand it. Maybe I have this color guard blocking me from dating out of my race. I've tried to rationalize it and open my eyes to it but I just found that hard to do.

I've mainly attended black schools all of my life, went to a black church, and interacted with millions of black people. I even graduated from a black college. So, some might say that I 'm just monocultural and not diverse. Well, contrary to that belief, I am now attending a White college and the thought of even getting a man out of my race makes

Now I know this may be off the subject, but what are people's thoughts of attending a college that is not of your own race. Meaning, if you;re White,a black college or if you're Black, a Native American college. For some reason, I think this goes hand in hand with the subject of interacial dating. The same friend that I talked about earlier went to a White school and basically has lost her sense of cultural identity, as is typical of many others. I think when you've grown up in an environment where people look like you and you've identified as role models, it provides a sense of comfort.

23. overlook color
Sun, Sep 19, 1999 - 9:45 AM/EST
qiana

alright now nubianpeach, I have also been around black people the majority of my life. I also have attended the same black church all my life even though I went to white high schools I did attend two historically black colleges while I lived in TN. Imet my husband when I was a sophomore at one of these colleges. And my husband did attend one of these schools also which had a white population of less than 10%. I believe that was hard for him to be a minority but it did allow him to learn alot about blacks and it made him sympathetic to the black cause where as before he had typical white views of " a black man has every chance that I do of getting ahead in this country, racial attitudes don't matter." But anyway I have also attended white schools(really white) and I hated it. They are not for me. And to get back to my other point. Even though I was mainly around blacks in my personal life I was never taught to hate other people.

24. response to qiana
Sun, Sep 19, 1999 - 5:55 PM/EST
nubianpeach

I don't hate other people, it's just this thing of pro-blackness. I think maybe if I were friends with a guy of the other race, first, and then fell in love with him, that would be different. But I don;t go out seeking it and surely no one from other races have tried to pursue me. Thus, because I'm in this black environment and this is alll that I'm accustomed to, my interaction with males of the other race are less.

I hope this is not confusing. Even in my classes, they are a majority White females. So, where would I find a man of another race? Even socially,I am in a Black sorority and ususally we congregate with each other and males that are the same race as us.

So, again, this pro-blackness is there. Maybe you didnt experience it, but it's definitely in me.

Hey, at least I'm trying to be open about my biases. I don;t have a probably interacting with other cultures because that's how you network. It's just the dating thing....I have hang-ups about.

Sometimes, I feel as if I'm going to marry someone of the other race because I have such strong feeligns.

I know the hardest part, would be family acceptance.

25. white/black
Mon, Sep 20, 1999 - 1:58 AM/EST
cold_ember

Unlike most of the people who have posted their messages, I am not in a biracial relationship. But I am an individual who constantly explores the unknown. I am a 25 year old black male and once pursued a biracial relationship, but have decided to participate in dating my own race. Not because I am prejudice, but because of the social norms that attack biracial relationships. That is to say, at the time I felt somewhat of a discomfort when my dating habbits where compromised with the relationship to a latina. I think it is of the utmost importence to discuss these issues as to further communicate to those who's views are currupt towards society as a whole.

26. Search the whole spectrum
Mon, Sep 20, 1999 - 12:02 PM/EST

This message is intended primarily for nubianpeach. I'm struggling to comprehend your whole attitude towards your "pro-blackness." Now, I am not saying there is anything wrong with that, I'm just not you. I can't live your life to really understand.

However, let me offer this story:

When I first saw my girlfriend, I felt the strongest pull of my life. I didn't know her at all, but I knew there was something very special. I got to know her for about two years before we started dating. Now, 5 years later, I am completely in love with her. Realizing we are soulmates, I want to spend the rest of my life with her.

I wasn't looking to date outside or inside my race. I was just looking for someone to compliment me. I found it in a black Cape Verdian woman. Sure, there has been some struggle with race, but nothing that cannot be overcome. Our families are fine, our friends are fine. Who cares about the rest! It is really just about us.

My advice is to search the whole spectrum. Try and be as open minded as possible. You never know who that special person may be.

On a side note:

I once dated a girl who is nearly the same ethnic makeup as myself. I instantly thought, "Wow! I've never met anyone THIS much like myself! She HAS to be the one!" So, I pursued her and we dated for awhile.

Shortly into the relationship, I had a strange feeling. It was kind of an icky feeling. I felt that she was a little TOO much like me. Almost like a relative. I couldn't bring myself to get too intimate with her. I can't really explain it fully. I just realized that I *might* be happier dating someone who was a little more diverse from me, even if she's white. So I broke up with her.

Something to think about . . .

27. Response to slugbait and nubianpeach
Mon, Sep 20, 1999 - 1:39 PM/EST
bbbarbs

I had a similar experience to slugbait. I knew from the time that I met my boyfriend that there would be something special between us. I have a hard time understanding nubianpeach's perspective on dating and problackness. In order to date outside your race, it doesn't mean that one actively says okay, now I'm going to date men outside my race. All it takes is to open one's mind to experiences that are different from your own. I also want to let you know that not all "white" people who date black people are uninterested in learning about the black experience. Even before I met my boyfriend I was extremely interested in black history because it is the history of this country. I took many sociology classes in college trying to learn more. Just because of one guy's ignorance who's dating your friend, please don't assume that we all think this way. It is something I can't understand.

About pro-blackness....I have tried to understand what it means and I still can't make sense of this term. My best friend's family is from the Caribbean and my boyfriend's family is from Nigeria and they have lived a blakc experience, but are shunned by African-Americans who claim to be pro-black. They shun my friends because they have friends who are white or are from other ethnic backgrounds. Why? How will we ever advance as a society if African Americans choose self-segregation and whites continuue to hate. I think everything stems from ignorance. If you don't know anything besides your own people and experience you can never move forward and accept everyone else.

28. slugbait, et al.
Mon, Sep 20, 1999 - 1:58 PM/EST
nubianpeach

My whole argument is, don't put down your own race and then go seek out something else. As I stated earlier, "The grass is always greener on the other side" or "The other man's milk is always sweeter." There's a problem when you put down your race and talk about what the other race of male/female species has to offer.

If you happen to fall in love or whatever with someone of a different race and there's absolutely nothing you can do about because you're so helplessly in love, then so be it.

But 7.5 times out of 10 and including the people that I know and have spoken with, dating interacially has a lot to do with curiosity. It is like this desire or unspoken dream to conquer. Some folks feel as if they can accomplich that, then they can accomplish anything in the world.

29. Curiosity....
Mon, Sep 20, 1999 - 2:17 PM/EST
bbbarbs

nubianpeach, I looked up your bio and I saw that you are from IL or go to school at UIUC. I live in Chicago in one of the few integrated middle-class neighborhoods in the city. There are many interracial couples who have been together for 50 years in this neighborhood. I don't think that the reason they are together is because of curiosity. It's not the reason that I am with my boyfriend either. We both thought about this after the series. We saw each other's skin color when we met, but after that we only looked at what was on the inside. Other people may not believe that but it's true. The reason I liked him so much was because of his compassion, not his looks. I'd never met a man as caring or faithful to his family, friends, and me before. My mother taught me to love a person for their mind, not how they look. Everyone would be much happier if they followed that advice.

My boyfriend and I do see examples of people dating or hooking up in Chicago whom we call the vampires. They dare to be seen with each other at a club or around at night when it's cool to be with someone and exoticize them. And a lot of them have the conquer mentality. Especially the black guys and white blonde women at clubs. They have their trophy piece on their arm. However I often have to take a step back and say, I don't know who these people are and they may truly love each other. The problem with the night club, white/black short-term relationships is that they give people trying to have real interracial relationships a hard time. I can't stand to see people at clubs try to pick up someone else because they are white or black. It is contrary to how I grew up and what I believe relationships are about. So....to answer the curiosity deal and the grass is greener....I find that discussion silly from my own experience. Nubianpeach it seems you may have some friends who are very closed minded.

30. littlekat's questions about how it is elsewhere
Mon, Sep 20, 1999 - 2:37 PM/EST
bbbarbs

In my previous post I mentioned that I live in Chicago in an integrated area. My boyfriend and I feel very comfortable here. There are other areas of the city though where we wouldn't feel safe. In most other places in the city we do receive either stares or dirty looks or stare of "hey, baby, since you're dating a black guy, I'm sure you'd like to date me." Most of the white people who stare are suburbanites. They look at us like we're aliens or "god, don't let my daughter get the disease she has." ( : A lot African American women give me looks like they want to kill me because I'm dating a well educated black man, instead of the thug type who they wouldn't want anyway. And a lot of black men think that since I'm dating a black man, that I would be interested in them.

All of these looks used to bother me, but now I laugh at these idiots. Their ignorance used to astound me, but now I could care less. We both usually completely ignore these people or laugh. Laughing helps a lot!

31. Yes,it can
Mon, Sep 20, 1999 - 5:16 PM/EST
xx-cin-xx

Hhmm,

I do think that a black and white relationship can work for long term,though it would be very hard since all relationships experience problems,without adding the race issue.Whose to say that it can't work,if we don't try,not that i'm saying that we must go out and try a relationship where both parties are of different races,but instead keep your mind open to all the possibilites.To tell u the truth i really don't see any problem why two persons of different skin colours,especially black/white together,can't be together.I don't know why i have this idea in my head,maybe its because i'm multiracial and also female not that we tend to think way differently than guys but i do think that most of us females are more open to the possibilites of an inter-racial relationship,or maybe its because i have both white/black/and all the other races that u can think about,or maybe its because i'm from south america originally where we really don't care that much about races,like north americans,or maybe its because i'm living in canada right now and i haven't experienced any racism,particulary to my face or so.I would really like some feed back on this please.Do any of u think that people like me who are either bi-racial or multi-racial think differently about racism or why people of different races can't be in a relationship?Well thats all for now.Peace out.

Xx-Cin-xX

32. Re: xx-cin-xx
Mon, Sep 20, 1999 - 6:47 PM/EST

I agree with you...I believe that if two people want to be together and should be together it 'll work. I really think it's more personality based than on the race of the people. Like it was said before if there is an attraction race sort of becomes irrelevant.

I do think that bi/multi racial people view the relationships differently and also racism. Maybe b/c I've experienced it and then had it explained to me that I see it differently. I always see racism as a way of enforcing nonexisting superiority and nonexisting inferiority. I don't know for sure if it's b/c of my race or my experiences...I think maybe its both.

33. Choosing to Date within or outside your race..
Mon, Sep 20, 1999 - 7:26 PM/EST
littlekat

If you look at why some people consciously choose to date a person who is the same race as them or a person who is not, it is usually because they see skin color an external marker for other characteristic they think that person will posess. Everybody has a list of things in their head of what they are looking for in a mate: some are personality issues; others are culturally based such as communication styles, food, traditions, language, ect; some people consider what their family, friends, coworkers, ect. will think of this person; and then of course there is physical appearance and what features are attractive to you. Many of these things are greatly impacted by a persons race and heritage, and I think that's why most people tend to date people of their same race. I think it is fine for people to say "these are the qualities I am looking for in a mate and I think I'm more likely to find them in someone of a particular ethnic background." But there is a fine line between making these kinds of distinctions about people and making relationship decisons based on faulty sterotypes. People who see dating outside their race as some kind of experiment or do it because they want to project a certain kind of image, piss me off. Enabling sterotypes to persist in any way will only lead to a continued lack of cross-cultural understanding and contribute to racial discrimination.

34. To littlekat
Tue, Sep 21, 1999 - 1:20 PM/EST
bbbarbs

I really enjoyed your last comment. I often ponder that exact topic. I have several friends who prefer to date someone from their own ethnic background. i've talked to them about their preferences and neither of them rule out people from other backgrounds, but as you said before they know that a person from their ethnicity most likely will share their same values. My problem is when people take stereotypes to the extreme, as you mentioned, and project them onto other people. Before my boyfriend was dating me, he was out with his friends and a white girl asked to dance with him. He asked her some questions and then all of a sudden she asked him, "How come you speak so properly?" He was so mad! He's an educated man, of course, he'll speak properly. She was so ignorant that she thought all black men would speak ebonics with her. How can we change people's minds when all of this ignorance persists? I personally think that most of the problem lies in the fact that this country is so segregated-or at least my city is. On an individual level I think people need to try to throw away their prejudices and try to learn about and befriend people who are different from themselves. What does everyone else think?

35. to everyone
Tue, Sep 21, 1999 - 10:45 PM/EST
beachgirl

i just finished reading all of the 34 posts before mine and it was very interesting. I think a relationship between black/whites can work definitelly. I believer it is harder, but in a lot of cases those struggles bring you together. my boyfriend and I have had bad comments from our families that we have had to deal with. One family member said I was confused! I did not start dating my boyfriend out of curiosity. First of all I love being black but I have always gone to mixed school, majority white, but lived in amajorly black neighborhood. I have always had friends from all races. My three best female friends are cuban/greek, puerto rican, and black. My boyfriend and I were friends first and i wasn't curios about dating a white guy I was just very attracted to the beautiful person he is and how great a friend he was to me during the hardest part of my life when no one else was there for me. I fell in love with the person he is and not his skin color because that doesn't matter to me. I am no less black by dating a white man and I think life would be pretty boring if we just stuck to same race relationships.

(sorry its so long)

36. Thanks!
Wed, Sep 22, 1999 - 4:45 PM/EST

I've read everyones comments and found them to be very interesting. It's good to hear different perspectives on matters (though everyone seems to have a relatively optimistic view, which doesn't really allow for us to get into any heated dialogue).

I would like to make a few negative statements about blacks:

Like it or not, COLLECTIVELY blacks are in societies basement: economically, academically, morally... Blacks have the highest percentage rates of parental dissertion; contribute the least to the economic growth of the country and are notoriously substandard in terms of academic achievement. Blacks have the highest percentage rates of recidivism and incarceration.

That's just in the states:

In Africa, there's civil war in every social union governed by blacks (swaziland was the murder capital of the world) and there is no progressive technology being engineered by blacks.

In Liberia (A country established by American slaves) they shoot one another in the streets...

So much for black solidarity, eh?

I feel that collectively negroes are indeed inferior, or at best obsolete; and if they are not, then why are the behavioral patterns of blacks so regressive?

But my main point is:

Until blacks collectively prove their equality by exercising brainpower on par with asians, whites, arabs or any other variation of human, then blacks will not be (and probably do not deserve to be) treated as equals, and accepted as such.

Of course there are exceptions (I am, after all an educated black pursuing an advanced degree in robotic engineering). But I am the harshest critique of blacks because all the woes of negroes are the result of the collectives inability to stand intellectually with other races, or show comparable civility.

And that's why race mixing with blacks is frowned upon, because everyone (especially blacks) believes that negroes are inferior; and everything negroes do collectivley reaffirms that.

proteux@hotmail.com

37. Response to Proteus
Wed, Sep 22, 1999 - 8:54 PM/EST
nubianpeach

I'm probably the outlier in the group because noone seems to agree with me about these issues but in this case, what are u talkin about?

Yes, as a Black race we have a long way to go, but excuse me as I recall you are Black. If you don;t have pride in your own race, who will?

I was sitting in class the other day, and my teacher is lecturing about statistics that Blacks face in the healthcare system. I tried to envision myself in the shoes of the Whites in the class, probably thinking, DAMN, I'm glad I'm not Black. The news was devastating. The Black man is oppressed. He has the shortest life expectancy, and prone to homicide. Blacks have a high neonatal death rate, poor health care, poor infant mortality rate. When she read all of these things, I said to myself, it's time for Black people as a whole to seek out some snswers to these problems.

We have to be proactive and not reactive. Let me ask you this Proteus, what are u doing to help my race, since the way it seems you dont want to identify yourself as Black? Are you going out into the neighborhoods being a role model to these young Black males?

38. Continuing..
Wed, Sep 22, 1999 - 9:03 PM/EST
nubianpeach

Have you given back to help those in need since you seem to say that you are an educated Black male. Well, I consider myself a fairly reasonably educated African American female but I'm not going to criticize the Black community. Yes, I have a lot of hangups about some of the things that Blacks do especially when it comes to fauly decision making but you have to be willing to do something about it.

And you dont have to go to Africa to get statistics on the plight of Blacks shooting each other. Walk down the streets of America and you will the see the problems of drugs, handguns, and illiteracy. Take a step back and look at our scoiety. It is chaotic, yes, but you have to be willing to put your investment into the future.

Also, being educated doesn't make anyone a better of a person. For most Blacks, they will frown upon that person and think, he or she is uppity and detached from reality. Possessing degrees will not solve problems,it's how you use those degrees towards the goodwill of society.

39. response to proteus
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - /EST
littlekat

I don't know if you are just trying to stimulate debate or if you are just incredibly cynical, but put in simplest terms -- you've go some serious issues. Yes, it is true that as a group blacks face more social difficulties than any other racial group. But I don't think it is fair to make that comment without ackowledging that black people have also endured more oppression and exploitation throughout the course of history, than any other group. I'm not into making excuses, but I am into understanding the roots of problems -- I believe it should be the first step in solving them. As a result I have studied a lot of history. This dialogue isn't really the proper venue for a lengthy history lesson, but we can find that many of today's problems are rooted in the destructiveness of centuries of colonization, slavery, discrimination, and even more seemingly innocuous things such as the creation of an welfare system which did little to encourage a work ethic.

To solve the community's problems we must initiate changes at the personal (ie, attitudes and aspirations), institutional (ie business and government policies) and societal levels (ie changing attiudes about race.) Everybody has got to play a part.

40. Dear Lost Proteus
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 1:21 AM/EST
qiana

Such dangerous, unbalanced, obviously ignorant stereotypical rhetoric like that should addressed carefully. Whether you are indeed a misinformed black individual with no understanding of self, or merely someone fueling a debate, consider the following; Africa was originally inhabited by blacks of varying cultures that established a civilization far more sophisticated than white Europeans. As far back as 300 A.D. our ancestors endured the influx of European Christianity and Islam that trickled down the northeastern portion of the continent resulting in conflicts/dissension. Thereafter they endured French conquests in the Northwest, apartheid/white rule in the South, and forced slavery, displacement, and persecution. Furthermore, in the U.S. a century elapsed between the slaves being emancipated and blacks recieving civil rights under the law. That means from a displaced, enslaved population you have generations of people that lived with no means of opportunity or educational/economic growth. That situation was only rectified roughly 30 years ago, and we are still fighting. Any person making such critical and influential observations about a group of people would surely consider the environment and any outside contributing factors, right? I would beg to differ and say that we as black people have always risen above and flourished even if you wish to measure our status to whites. This is my initial response, however, I would really like to flood you with the accomplishments and contributions the majority of blacks have made but which get overshadowed by negative, slanted opinions such as yours. It is foreseeable to have blacks be an influential economic force and competitive in the technology frenzy, etc. However, we shouldn't be negative considering there has never existed the time/place long enough for blacks to simply exist, communicate, plan, teach, support, etc. without an onslaught of non-contributing forces with attitudes not unlike yours.

41. The Truth About Blacks...
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 4:02 PM/EST

I understand that some of the things I said are upsetting, but I'm just trying to "keep it real" folks...

I've spent a lot of time considering the condition of blacks in this nation and globally, there are certain undeniable patterns in negro behavior which I just cannot ignore.

I've heard a few excuses made for blacks but the truth is blacks have no one to blame but themselves.

If blacks are indeed the intellectual equals of the other races then how did we manage to become exclusively enslaved by them?

Why was Africa conquered and appropriated by European armies? The English fought with guns and the Zulu fought with spears...

If blacks are intellectually equal, then why do we live at the bottom of the socio-economic pyramid in EVERY nation we inhabit?

Why do blacks kill one another in the streets like animals, in EVERY nation we govern or inhabit?

BECAUSE WE CAN"T COMPETE INTELLECTUALLY.

In the life of each man there comes a time where he must stand and account for himself, and stop making excuses...

Blacks have been on this planet just as long, or longer than anyone else. No one said life is FAIR, but to transcend your circumstances is a testament to human ingenuity, and collectively we are a failed race, plain and simple.

42. Either I'm right or the world is a hallucination...
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 4:25 PM/EST

I understand anyone who says,"that's bullshit!" and thinks I'm ignorant, lost or misinformed...

Also whoever said I don't have any pride, well you're right. I don't see anything to be proud of...

But also understand that I am indeed black. I'm reticent to even SHARE these ideas because of that fact.

But here's the point which will bring all this "full-circle".

Blacks are more inclined to race-mixing because subconsciously we are trying to ASSIMILATE ourselves!

Especially in the states where there is greater pressure NOT to be black, and where the opportunity is more readily available to create hybrid offspring...

Ladies and gentlemen, there it is, I'm looking forward to your rebuttals and denouncements.

43. Curiosity made the cat fall in love (sorta)
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 6:37 PM/EST

To nubianpeach:

Yes, I must admit that part of me was curious about dating someone outside my race. BUT, it was the PERSON that I fell into. That FAR outweighed any curiosity.

Maybe curiosty, in that sense, can be a good thing? It might help people to be more open about all kinds of cultures (no, not yogurt). ;)

44. Why are you staring at us?
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 6:42 PM/EST

To bbbarbs:

You and I are on a level. I can really relate to A LOT of what you said.

As far as the stares go, yikes. They can be cold and penetrating. Many people will resent it or just plain not-get-it.

My hope is that society will evolve beyond such trivial issues.

Anywho, I wish you the best and all the happiness in the world!

45. Re: to everyone
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 6:46 PM/EST

To beachgirl:

Well said! If only there were more people like you in the world . . .

46. Responses
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 6:56 PM/EST
nubianpeach

Are u trying to imply that Blacks are genetically inferior to Whites?

You brought up very good points..

This forum was not designed to attack anyone personally. When people get into name-calling, it only creates problems. So I won't call you lost or mis-guided soul but only imply it.

I don't necessarily agree with all of what you have to say but people don't agree with me either.

Now, the subject at hand:

You quote: "and collectively we are a failed race, plain and simple." Again I'm going to ask you, what are U(Proteus) going to do about it?

You sit here and say that it is time to stop making excuses, what do you think you are doing? Laying back and criticizing is only aggravating the problem. Do you have all of these frustrations because you are not accepted by your own race group? When you mentioned earlier in another topic that others were insecure with their identities and made you feel excluded from hanging out with Blacks, I believe you have your own identity problems.

To answer your questions: (1) You are only perpetuating this problem by making Blacks feel inferior. If you have someone constantly telling you that you will amount to nothing and that you will never achieve, what do you think is going on in this Black person's mind? This is oppression. Blacks cannot only blame themselves. There are many other factors involved. Noone can answer that question of why we were enslaved as a race of people. I don't know why Massa' slept with my ggggrandmother, but regardless, we have to use slavery as a stepping stone and move on. We are the minority. Since you like statistics, Blacks are only 12% of the population. On the other hand, there are 75% White people in this society. It was easy for them to subjugate Blacks into slavery. They figured the same things you were saying: Blacks are ignorant, will amount to nothing, and are easy to control.

47. And it continues.....
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 7:01 PM/EST
nubianpeach

It is also important to add that Blacks should not use slavery as way to get over and use that as a crutch to say that's why they are not achieveing in this society.

As far as intellectually ability, I look up to my father who has a Ph.D, a brother that has a master's degree in BioMedical Engineering, Chemical Engineering, a master's degree in Business Administration, another brother who is a Certified Public Accountant, and a mother that is a nurse. As for myself, a broke grad student. :)

So, you're going to sit here and tell me that we are intellectually inferior. (Bullshit..) I know more Blacks with equal rank and many accomplishments. Some Blacks don't exercise their mental ability, but that doesn't mean that they cannot. Though we dont represent the typical Black family, that's not to say that others cannot do the same things.

Since you dont have this pride, let me ask you this...What do you have pride in? If not yourself, who?

48. I Can't Spell It Out Anymore Proteus...
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 8:30 PM/EST
qiana

--Why slavery?--

Slavery was aided by a minority population in Africa which was cultivated and financed by Europeans. The fact that black people didn't have the means to defend themselves from the slave trade doesn't constitute them as weak or inferior. Is a woman inferior in intellect when she is overpowered by an aggressor? Are the Jews inferior for being collectively devastated by the Germans? Are the American Indians inferior for not anticipating the measure of evil in the hearts and minds of settlers? Are the people in Tibet inferior for underestimating the precise political, economic, and military devices planted and aggravated by China? Were the people killed in the Oklahoma city bombing weak because they hadn't evolved with the physical capabilities or instints to thwart a plan of terror? The truth is that no human being has a God given ability to anticipate and defend against such evil. To this day, despite a human history plagued often by war and destruction, human beings have never been born with this posture to anticipate and defend against evil. Even today, nobody has the ability to anticipate an enemy pressing the button, and also lacking would be a successful measure of defense.

--Guns vs. spears--

Societies sporting the most sophisticated instruments of war but demonstrating a diminished capacity in social structure, family structure, moral structure, and reverence to our Creator should not be admired, nor modeled after. However, it will always be (and always has been) the people that continue to live as intended that will suffer from those who choose a path of destruction.

49. And to Finish
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 8:31 PM/EST
qiana

--Bottom of every socio-economic pyramid?--

Again, blacks have never been in an environment long enough without the intrusion of war-like parties disabling the means of community, communication, education, economic growth, etc. Slavery+displacement=break in community, language, culture, religion + failed "New South"+ a century of no means of education or economic growth+ no civil rights= 30 years ago. Since then we still have limited economic and educational opportunities despite other minorities who are embraced by our government and saturated with federal assistance to prosper with businesses in our communities. China enjoys the financial and economic benefits of preferred Nation status while our communities are targeted with drugs, alcohol, guns, profiling, poor schools and health care, and no base (loans) for economic growth. Why are Jews able to charge Germans with war crimes and have returned gold and artifacts when blacks were never awarded their 40 acres and a mule.

--Blacks kill?--

Statistics for white on white crime are staggering as well. History suggests that whites prefer to target indigionus people at a rate and intensity that ceases to be measured (or perhaps has never been revealed and put on the marquee as the emphasis of black crime).

--Can't compete?--

Relying predominatly on public education leaves us at the mercy of federal and state authorities that keep their heels on the throats of black communtities. Want a change, want to help by building up your community, well just step in line behind the Asian immigrant that has little education or language skills but will be heading to the bank with loan approval to start a robust business. If only Haitian immigrants are so welcome and encouraged.

--Blacks inclined--

Ask Jean Toomer or Tiger Woods how well your theory of assimilating works

50. To Proteus: Truth before judgement...
Thu, Sep 23, 1999 - 11:08 PM/EST
littlekat

I was particularly struck by the irony of this statement by Proteus. " No one said life is FAIR, but to transcend your circumstances is a testament to human ingenuity, and collectively we are a failed race, plain and simple."

In my studies of history I have been repeatedly impressed and inspired by the spirit and strength of the African American community. Faced with intense oppresion, disenfranchisement, and persecution, the black commmunity as a whole has continued to struggle and fight to succeed. I have to wonder, Proteus, have you ever studied history or sat and listened to the wisdom of those who fought for Civil Rights in the 60's. If the ability to transend circumstances is a testament to ingenuity, then this must certainly be a characteristic of the black race.

In the span of history how can you judge a people by 50 years of chaos as they stuggle to rebuild a continent ramsacked by invaders, or by 20 years characterized by a drug epidemic and its accompanying activities? You can't. You have to open your eyes to the entire picture, not choose to see only the evidence which supports your arguments. It is basic premise of logic and critical thought.

As and "educated" person, Proteus, I would think you would know that.

51. Proteus
Fri, Sep 24, 1999 - 5:02 PM/EST

I must continue to process my thoughts on most of your ideas....I'm not quite sure what to make of it...my instinct is to say that it is stupid...however, you are obviously an intelligent person and I think that I owe you the respect to process the concepts and get back to you. However, one thing that I can say now...I study Sociology and have read the latest research on criminal activity and the statistical facts behind crime rates (so, you know I'm not making it up! =0D). Anyway, this is in response to the idea that black people kill each(only for the States)everyday. Yes, it is true, black people do kill each other. The same way that white people do. Actually according to the latest research, more white people kill each other than blacks. However, because there are more whites than blacks the numbers are ridiculously high. If they were to make the numbers comparable we would see that blacks kill less of themselves than whites do. This is just one of the ways that past researchers "proved" the insuperiority of blacks..."hey they kill more of themselves than whites". However, recent researchers have sought to prove that it is indeed misinforming society....and I beleive in currect research they inform the reader that the numbers are not comparable.

I'll get back to you on the other ideas.

Just wanted to let you know, I don't think it's like that in Africa....but that is the

52. Proteus..one more thing
Fri, Sep 24, 1999 - 5:12 PM/EST

So, if you are going to ask why blacks continuosly kill each other on a daily basis, you must also question why whites do it. It is not fair nor it is right to put all of the emphasis on blacks. By doing so you are enforcing the negative stereotype, which has been continuosly exagerated for many years...for example most people have been led to believe that most of the people on welfare are black women/families with five or six kids. Actually most are white women with two to three kids. Once again, the facts have been taken out of context and altered to fit a negative stereotype.

53. Here's my Malcom X Speech....
Fri, Sep 24, 1999 - 6:13 PM/EST

Yes, there are educated blacks!

Yes, blacks have gotten some unfair breaks!

Yes, blacks are disenfranchised!

Yes, there have been significant contributions to society engineered by blacks!

I can site a dozen examples of black people who contradict everything I've said. But they're the EXCEPTION, I'm speaking in terms of the race as a WHOLE.

I FEEL...

Every race can cry "foul play" about something for some past greivance or injustice...

It's like a triathlon, or chessgame; in the end there's a winner and a loser, and blacks have been "the loser" for a long time...

Why is that?

Help me understand then, if blacks are just as well-equipped to succeed as anyone else then why haven't we? Why don't blacks have the same organizational skills as other groups?

We've been on this planet a long time, we were slaves.. So what? So were the Irish, the Slavic, the Polish. Everybody had to lick boots at some point...

True; blacks have had a lot of unfair breaks in America, but it would have never have happened if we had "our act together" in the first place.

And I think that if you want to talk in terms of the Civil Rights movement, I would even dare say that we could be much further along since 1968 if we pooled our resources and educated ourselves.

If we had half the drive, discipline and intellect of the Chinese we could be the power-brokers of the 21st century...with the resource base of Africa and the U.S. at our dispense, but we choose to be foot-shuffling no-accounts that blame "the man" for our woes.

Why do we lag so far behind in EVERYTHING? Is it how we're socialized? If that's the case then we need to start re-assessing what our culture truly is...

54. Re:Sessa
Sat, Sep 25, 1999 - 5:13 AM/EST
xx-cin-xx

Thank u Sessa,for agreeing with me.Yes maybe its because we are multiracial or biracial and so on that we tend to think a little bit different but i really don't see where the problem.To me a person is a person.According to the saying.if u cut me,won't i bleed just like u,and not green bllod.red blood.Also i do think that black people especially tend to judge people on races more,if they see a white and a black person walking down the street.Why is that?I have no clue,and i'm not trying to put down black people or anything but its true,they also tend to treat people like me differently as though its my fault that my mother and father had sex and made me.I really don't understand that.Please if someone would like to explain to me or something.

Xx-Cin-xX

55. Proteus
Sat, Sep 25, 1999 - 5:30 AM/EST
xx-cin-xx

Proteus,

U keep saying that you're proud to be black and so on but yet u keep on putting them down?Whats that all about?You of all people should know that the blacks are doing way better in this day and age and yes,they do have their faults as so do the other races too.Lots of blacks are succeeding today and as someone who is part black,i am happy to say that i like having black.Nothing wrong with that.There's nothing wrong with being any particular race,yes being one race does have it hardships and blacks do have hardships.For one thing,lots of blacks can't get a job because 1.of their skin colour.2.their boss is probably white or so and he probably doesn't like blacks.Those are just some of the factors that contributes to these things.U can't blame one thing for the things that happens today.And the blacks do not lag behind in everything.Everyone has a brain and i happen to think that black people are very smart.For one thing they have the best fashion sense ever.Most of their music is great,look as Chris Rock said,who do white people come ten years later trying to do something that they blacks have been doing for a long time now.Example,with the rapping and so on,the bringing together rapping and rock together.Bands like Limp Bizkit,Korn,Rage against the machine,all of those bands i am a big fan of.And the clothes.So u see Proteus,u're talking as thoough blacks are good for nothing.sheesh.

Xx-Cin-xX

56. I Surrender!
Mon, Sep 27, 1999 - 11:39 AM/EST

Alright ladies,

I've read and re-read your posts and I've come to the conclusion that even if I COULD convince you of some things, I wouldn't WANT to...

Nothing constructive can come of it, anyway...

But I'd like to ad that some of the harshest condemnations ever made towards blacks came from the mouths of:

Fredrick Douglas

W.E.B. DuBois

G.W. Carver

Malcom X

Martin Luther King

Rather than make excuses for their kinsmen, they subjected them to the sharpest scrutiny.

Until blacks can assume a leadership role on the world stage, and stand as monuments to technological genius (instead of athleticism and entertainment). I've got to sneeze at them...

57. xx-cin-xx
Mon, Sep 27, 1999 - 12:51 PM/EST

YES!!!! I did not ask my parents to meet, fall in love, get married, and make me b/c of their love!! I had nothing to do with it, yet some people act as if we had a say in the whole process. We didn't! Did they have a say in being white or black or purple and red stripes? NO!!! I have talke with people about it...and the only reasoning we could come up with is this: There is this misconception that bi/multiracial people think they are superior...and people look down on us b/c of that. I don't think we're superior...I think that maybe some of us show that we are proud of who we are...but there is no superiority. That's all anyone can come up with, though...any better ideas?

58. Here's an idea
Mon, Sep 27, 1999 - 2:23 PM/EST

I think most blacks subconsciously feel that bi-racial people are superior or that they have the best of both worlds (which of course, isn't true).

They get racism from BOTH sides.

But in all actuality, the bi-racial person DOES represent what is generally viewed as the "best" that blacks have to offer...

Look at popular culture (The Cosby Show). Our society teaches us that "pure bred" blacks are less desireable.

59. Re:To Sessa
Thu, Sep 30, 1999 - 5:03 PM/EST
xx-cin-xx

Yes Sessa,It wasn't our fault that our parents fell in love & made us.It wasn't our faults that they didn't think that even though they are of different skin colours & backgrounds that they can't fall in love.Its the same for pure blacks or pure whites or whatever your race is.It wasn't your fault that your parents fell in love with someone of their own race so please people,don't judge anyone like that.I'm from Guyana South America,& the majority of people living there are blacks & east-indians.Over there the blacks hate most of the east-indians & the east-indians hate most of the blacks too.Both of those races too hate native people.People who are mixed,has it a bit better.They have a special name for us mixed people,they call us doglas.I don't know why they call us that but they do its not an insulting name they just do.When i was in high school some blacks & east-indians never wanted to be my friends because i was mixed.I don't know why because I certainly do not think that i'm superior over anyone,i love being multiracial,i like having over five races in me,why?because i feel that it somehow connects me to everyone in the world.One of my closest friends(who is black) told me one day that she thinks that i will marry a white or portuguese man and that always in my life i would be treated better than a pure black or east-indian .I was stunned at this because i have been attracted to lots of people from different races.It didn't matter.I asked her why and she said because i had lighter skin colour & that i had curly hair,& that i was of white & portuguese decent & stuff like that & that most of my closest friends were of either white or portuguese.I was mad but after a while i talked it over with her & i kind of got her point of view.I guess she was saying this because she knew from experience that some people didn't like her because she was black and so on,& might even deprive her of a job that she wanted just because of the fact that she was black.

Xx-Cin-xX

60. Repsonse to XX-cin-XX
Thu, Sep 30, 1999 - 6:41 PM/EST
nubianpeach

I just wanted to add that there is no such thing as pure Black. You stated that "I would be treated better than a pure black or east-indian."

I could consider myself multi-racial, although I classify myself as Black, considering that both of my biological parents are Blacks. My African ancestors having been raped by a White man who was of Scottish, Irish, and English descent.

Not trying to be technical, it's just a pet peeve of mine when people say that. Your other points were well-taken.

61. Re: xx-cin-xx
Fri, Oct 1, 1999 - 4:02 PM/EST

I understand. My black friends think that I will marry a white man b/c a majority of my friends are/look white. I don't choose my friends by color...I choose them b/c of who they are. The same with boyfriends...I grew up with people not wanting to be my friends(except whites), this may be conceited, but I think it's their loss...b/c I, as you are, a great person regardless of color.

62. Re:Sessa
Fri, Oct 1, 1999 - 7:38 PM/EST
xx-cin-xx

ha!haha!ha!Yes thats true.I don't know why some people think that but as u said it their loss.As far as i'm concerned i'll be friends with anyone that i want to and also have boyfriends with anyone of any colour.Its there own loss if they don't want to be friends with me or u or anyone else because of their own loss.

Xx-Cin-xX

63. Re:Nubianpeach
Fri, Oct 1, 1999 - 7:56 PM/EST
xx-cin-xx

Hii,

Yea actually i saw that mistake that i said about the pure black thing there.I do believe that everyone here isn't pure anything.So its okay for being technical.

Xx-Cin-xX

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